Does anyone have access to WT library? I was having this debate with this guy about handguns and he was saying you can have one if it's for something specific like hunting. (Or even for self defense if left in the house)
But i don't think that's true, otherwise we can be police officers. But i want to know what the society says exactly.
You can have one for hunting... I dont know about self defense though... but really, who uses a handgun for hunting??
see, i dont even think that is correct. Because handguns have been specifically manufacted to harm other humans. that is the intended purpose.
But people do carry them when hunting, i've heard...like, i guess if the animal doesnt die from the initial shot.
Handguns are legal in some states to hunt. Not in NJ though.
I real man just walks up to the animal and stabs it! haha
but isn't hunting just for the sake of killing or sport unscriptural? the reason i ask is because in a state like nj, getting a hunting license, buying a gun, and all the other stuff you have to do in order to actually go hunting, on top of all the things you have to do after you kill an animal is really expensive. making hunting in nj your primary source of getting food is unrealistic, b/c the cost of hunting exceeds that of just going to the store and buying meat by so much, that it becomes in reality just a form of entertainment, or sport. so if you look at it in that perspective, any hunting in nj is not scriptural. right? does that make any sense?
It's fine as long as you eat what you kill.
That's right. An elder in my old congregation goes hunting every year with brothers from upstate NY. When he comes back he cuts up the steaks for himself and makes ground meat like for venison burgers, whatever's extra he gives out to friends.
that's what i understand as well
well what if you kill a human
then you gotta eat up! lol ewwww
hahahaha
I'll give you my take since I am a hunter. I hunt deer. I will usually let Does go by because I am after Bucks. There's a certain thrill to a hunt, but I was always taught to respect the animal I kill. That animal is eaten. In fact I like venison a lot. Mostly, I just enjoy being out in the woods. I don't have to kill anything to enjoy myself.
You're touching on a couple of points there.
Here's some answers from the wt lib.
Can a Christian maintain a good conscience if he accepts employment that involves being armed? w05 11/1 p.31
Jehovah’s Witnesses the world over take seriously their God-given responsibility to provide materially for their families. (1 Timothy 5:8) However, certain forms of employment are in clear violation of Bible principles and should be avoided. These include employment connected with gambling, the misuse of blood, and the promoting of tobacco products. (Isaiah 65:11; Acts 15:29; 2 Corinthians 7:1; Colossians 3:5) Other types of work, though not directly condemned in the Bible, could violate one’s conscience or the conscience of others.Engaging in secular work that requires carrying a firearm or another weapon is a personal decision. However, armed employment exposes one to the possibility of becoming bloodguilty if called upon to use one’s weapon. Hence, a Christian needs to consider prayerfully whether he is willing to accept the burden of making a snap decision where human life is involved. Carrying a weapon also exposes a person to the danger of injury or death from an attack or reprisal.
Others may be affected by one’s decision as well. For instance, a Christian’s primary responsibility is preaching the good news of God’s Kingdom. (Matthew 24:14) Would it be possible to teach others to “be peaceable with all men,” while at the same time earning a living by carrying a weapon? (Romans 12:18) What about children or other family members? Would having a handgun in the house put their lives in danger? Moreover, could others be stumbled by one’s stand on the matter?—Philippians 1:10.
In these “last days,” more and more people are “fierce, without love of goodness.” (2 Timothy 3:1, 3) Knowing this, could a person remain “free from accusation” were he to choose armed employment that might bring him into conflict with such individuals? (1 Timothy 3:10) Hardly. For this reason, the congregation would not regard such a person as “irreprehensible” if he continued to carry a weapon after being kindly given Bible counsel. (1 Timothy 3:2; Titus 1:5, 6) Thus, such a man or woman would not qualify for any special privileges in the congregation.
Jesus assured his disciples that if they put Kingdom interests first in their lives, they need not be overly concerned about having the necessities of life. (Matthew 6:25, 33) Indeed, if we place our full trust in Jehovah, “he himself will sustain [us]. Never will he allow the righteous one to totter.”—Psalm 55:22.
When Armed Robbers Strike w98 12/15 (excerpt)
Some people desperately seek security by arming themselves with guns. Christians, though, take seriously the words of Jesus, who said: “Those who take the sword will perish by the sword.” (Matthew 26:52) God’s people have ‘beaten their swords into plowshares’ and do not buy guns to protect themselves from robbery or assault.—Micah 4:3.What about arranging for armed security guards? While this would be a matter for personal decision, remember that such an arrangement puts the gun in the hands of someone else. What would an employer expect of the guards if a robber came along? Would he expect the guards to shoot the thief if necessary to protect the people and possessions that were being guarded?
So to sum this up, a baseball bat works just as well, and has non-lethal effects if you whack the person in the arms and legs.
live by the sword, die by the sword. You don't have to kill with a sword to live by the sword. Peter merely cut the high priest's assistant's ear off. He didn't slay the man. But Jesus uttered those words, anyway. Just because you can pull a bat on someone and NOT kill em, doesn't mean you should.
*Just because I say this, doesn't mean I know what I would if I were protecting my family in a situation like this. When I was 13, and left at the house alone for the very first time, I carried a knife with me until my mom got back home, lol. Of course, I've come a long way from there since then.... except for the carrying a knife on me in case I'm alone and get attacked part. jk. Why am I talking?
Actually my statement was a joke. But, I mean I think most of our natural reactions would be to defend ourselves if we're attacked. I'm not going to let someone beat me unless I know it's to defend Jehovah's name. Then it's an honor to be beat up. If it's just a guy breaking in, I'd probably drop kick him. LOL!
hmm i agree with you. And yes I sleep with my gun under my pillow. kidding kidding, it's a knife! haha kidding kidding.. ..
or am i?!
You pull a knife on me and I will use my chop socky moves on you! Haha...
the other week i came home, i put my backpack down and next think i know i have a knife pressed up against my neck and todd was all decked out in fatigues yelling at me in cantonese... why cantonese??
Haha... Todd is a North Korean commando in disguise.
well, once I realized it was matt, I put the knife down. But I smashed a bottle of sake over his head. because sake is also popular in china, where I learned Cantanese.
Hahaha I totally started having palpitations lol! I thought you were serious right up until the todd part!
thanks Ian. So, does it say anything about hunting? or not?
Hunting is hunting. Doesn't matter what weapon you use.
okay, but i don't get it then, about hunting because if you own a handgun and keep it in your house, don't you think you'd go get that if you heard a robber in your house?
I have a bow and arrows with broadheads on them. Does that mean if I hear someone break in, I'm going to grab it with the arrow drawn back waiting for the kill? No. Handguns are used in western states for hunting. Some just like the challenge of using that instead of a conventional rifle or shotgun.
Some animals you can only use a handgun for in certain states.
yeah like shooting at squirrels from your porch.
Hahaha! These are the areas where people don't lock their doors, and interestingly, where crazy rapists/serial killers run to escape the law. This country is so crazy.
Or you can be like a certain brother I know and shoot deer out your window. LOL!!
You are right. I think certain birds out west you can only shoot with a handgun.
its considered unsportsmanlike and/or unfair to use a rifle
All the brothers who've hunted that I've known have either used bows or rifles. I can't see someone hunting with a handgun - it seems like that person is stretching to cause a little controversy.
oh, he definatly is. he's a good friend of austin's that lives about 3 hours away, and every.single.time he comes to visit, he starts up some kind of debate with me, because we have differing opinions about everything. he's so annoying like that.
My rationale for saying a hand gun in the house is inappropriate for self defense is the fact that bethel asked bro/sis to leave because they were doing tae bo 'to learn self-defense' for living in brooklyn. They said it was unacceptable to practice violence like that. A simple ladies' self defense class is one thing, as is a home security system, but practicing karate, or keeping a gun, is more overt.
Unless the person is a hunter who travels to areas where handguns can be used, I don't see the need to have one around here. I can see hunters in more woodsy areas keeping them in case a bear or another large animal attacks at close proximity.
Maybe you should read this guy the scripture about not debating god's word - it's one thing to talk about scriptural points to flex your mind muscles and encourage, but he's clearly upsetting you just for the sake of upsetting you.
yea, exactly. and he was definatly just trying to upset me because he starts out by saying..."so what would you say if Austin wanted to get a handgun".
so gay.
What a jerk! Smack him for acting like a 14 year old.
Exactly... in fact a brother from a Congregation in MA went hunting with his PO and he mentioned that you cant really justify owning a hand gun for hunting. If you did own one it would be questioned...
Ultimately this is a conscience matter. If you keep the handgun locked up with the rest of your shotguns and such in a gun cabinet, then I could justify it. If you are leaving it under your mattress or in a dresser, then that's questionable.
I was wondering this so i looked it up:
Since a brother who continues in armed employment would not be regarded as exemplary, would it be wrong for one of Jehovah’s Witnesses to seek the protection of armed law-enforcement officers?
Jesus stated: “All those who take the sword will perish by the sword.” (Matthew 26:52) In line with this principle, mature Christians are admonished to avoid employment that requires them to carry a firearm (the modern equivalent of “the sword”). However, this does not mean that they could not seek and receive the protection of armed police officers. Why do we say so?
Romans 13:1-4, in referring to human governmental “authority” that operates by God’s permission during the present system, says this: “It is God’s minister to you for your good. But if you are doing what is bad, be in fear: for it is not without purpose that it bears the sword; for it is God’s minister, an avenger to express wrath upon the one practicing what is bad.” So God approves of the arming of such “superior authorities,” that a measure of law and order may be preserved among mankind. However, when Christ as “Prince of Peace” brings in the ‘abundance of endless peace,’ the use of all weapons of violence will be a thing of the past. Consistently with the Scriptures, then, Christians today may accept protection from the “authority,” though they themselves have ‘beaten swords into plowshares’ in anticipation of God’s incoming Kingdom.—Isaiah 2:4; 9:6, 7.
We might compare the situation today with that back in Jeremiah’s time. It was then that Jehovah used the army of “Nebuchadrezzar the king of Babylon, my servant” to execute judgment on the apostate kingdom of Judah. Did Jeremiah and Baruch arm themselves for protection in that critical situation? No, for Jehovah himself made Jeremiah “a fortified city and an iron pillar and copper walls against all the land.” And though they did not join the army of Jehovah’s executional “servant,” they accepted deliverance by that “servant” when Jerusalem was destroyed.—Jeremiah 1:17-19; 25:9; 39:11-14.
Likewise today, Jehovah’s Witnesses pursue peace as they proclaim the Kingdom message in a violent world. However, as long as Jehovah permits governmental authorities to bear the “sword” or its modern-day equivalent in preserving order, they may rightly accept the protection of that “sword.”
This too:
The Watchtower of July 15, 1983, discussed why true Christians do not carry or keep guns for use against humans or protection from them. (Pages 23-6) Meditating on that counsel has led some Witnesses to reevaluate having even hunting guns. Not a few have chosen to get rid of their guns altogether or to avoid having them on display and readily accessible. These Christians thus would not give the impression of taking pride in weapons or trusting in them. Furthermore, not even having hunting guns, or not having them easily accessible, can avert tragedy. The deadly weapons could not then come into the hands of children who might accidentally hurt or kill someone, nor would guns be at hand if someone was extremely frightened or depressed.—Compare Proverbs 22:3.
I think it's a law to have a lock on the trigger of the gun in this state. That guarentees kids can't do anything dumb.
mmmmmmmmmmmmm... handguns..... droooooooollllllzzzz
hahahahaha, yummy
lick
firing a .50 is like a cannon in your hand